Green Giants – Episode 23

Unlocking the Future of Clean Energy: Lisa Jacobson, President of BCSE, on Renewable Trends, Policy Breakthroughs, and Industry Collaboration

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Transcript

Wes Ashworth (00:01)

Welcome to another episode of Green Giants, Titans of Renewable Energy. Today we have a distinguished guest joining us. Lisa Jacobson is the President of the Business Council for Sustainable Energy. With over two decades of experience shaping energy and climate policy, Lisa leads a 65 member trade association representing the renewable energy, energy efficiency, and natural gas industries. She’s been at the forefront of advising federal and state policymakers and has testified before Congress on critical energy issues. Lisa, it’s an honor to have you with us today.

Lisa Jacobson (00:31)

It’s great to be with you. Thank you for the opportunity.

Wes Ashworth (00:34)

Yeah, of course. So we’ll start out with a little intro before we dive into your work at BCSE. Can you share a bit about your journey and what initially sparked your interest in the energy sector? And then how did that ultimately lead to your role as president of BCSE?

Lisa Jacobson (00:49)

Sure, thank you. Well, I went to college and was interested in studying political science, so thinking about how Government works and how to shape policy. I did that and had the opportunity to work in Washington, DC for Congress as a legislative aide for a number of years. But the work I was doing was mostly domestic policy focused, things like education or health care, and I got increasingly interested in global environmental issues. So after several years working for Congress, I went to grad school and kind of flipped my focus to international trade and development. And at the time I was in graduate school, which you know I’m gonna date myself here, goes back you know 20 plus years, there was a lot of conversation about global climate change and opportunities for the United States as well as other countries to reduce emissions and to really rethink how they plan for energy and environmental infrastructure. I was very interested in that and I had some friends who were more involved in climate change and things like environmental economics.

So when I left graduate school, I really wanted to work with the business community because I really thought that was critical to ensuring our success because we need public-private partnership to tackle issues as vast in scope as global climate change. So I was fortunate enough when I left grad school to start working for the organization that I’m working with today, which is really unusual in today’s marketplace, Business Council for Sustainable Energy. And obviously the organization’s changed quite a bit and my focus with the organization has also changed. But it’s been an amazing journey to see how the energy transition is progressing and have the opportunity to work with companies that are true leaders on reducing emissions and also helping to build resilience into our energy economy.

Wes Ashworth (02:47)

Yeah, that’s incredible. And I would say, yes, it is extremely rare today for that to happen, but I’m always amazed to see it. But I want to get into, I guess, to start out sort of the current state of sustainable energy or the renewable energy sectors as you see it. So what are some of the most significant trends you’re seeing right now? And kind of fill us in from your side of the equation.

Lisa Jacobson (03:08)

Sure, well, you know, in addition to just following it, you know, through our leadership table, Business Council for Sustainable Energy releases each year something we call the Sustainable Energy in America Factbook, which we have commissioned by Bloomberg New Energy Finance, so Bloomberg NEF, and we’re in our 13th year right now of this project. So if you kind of go back in time, 13, 14 years, we were seeing some significant changes in the US energy sector. We saw them in the areas where we were working. We were working as, renewable energy, energy efficiency, natural gas. They were really dominating our energy economy and we could see the beginnings of some other developments, like in the areas of energy storage or carbon capture sequestration.

We were seeing those areas just beginning to perk up, but we didn’t have a resource that could help us track the facts as it relates to the transitions that we could see that we’re starting. So that’s why we created the Sustainable Energy in America Factbook. So, in addition to just witnessing these changes, I have some data that I can share. I think in all of our analysis each year on the fact book, we look at kind of maybe five or six big trends and then we try to respond to the topics in that moment with a look at the data from the previous year. So the most recent fact book that came out came out in February 2024, and the most recent data year was 2023. And we’ll have one coming out in early 2025 which will capture a lot of the activity this year. So big picture trends that we look at, we look at investment trends, we look at deployment trends and how that’s impacting the energy mix in the United States from mostly power sector oriented. We’re also looking at transportation and we look a lot at sustainable transportation trends like electric vehicle sales or renewable natural gas and natural gas vehicle trends.

We look at decarbonization technology trends, so things that are somewhat new like hydrogen investment or as I mentioned before, carbon capture storage. We look at how the private sector in particular is engaging because a lot of the change that we’ve seen is due to private sector demand. So how are corporations looking at their energy management and are they procuring clean energy, whether that be in terms of clean fleets or renewable electricity to power their facilities. There’s just so much activity that the private sector touches. And then finally we look at policy.

The big headline for the 2024 Factbook was, despite a lot of changes and headwinds we still faced in our economy as a whole, like high interest rates or supply chain challenges, we saw record breaking deployment numbers across pretty much all of our benchmark data. So record breaking investment, record breaking renewable energy output, record breaking renewable energy proportion of our generation mix, increases in our energy productivity, which is meaning that we can grow our economy without using as much energy. So electric vehicle sales, energy storage, I mean, I could just go on. So across all the major areas that we look at, we saw record breaking years. And for us, it really went back to this push that we got from policy activity in the year or two before. So things like the Inflation Reduction Act or the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law or the CHIPS and Science Act, which really sent these strong market signals to invest in cleaner energy resources and to invest in modern infrastructure. Because when we invest in modernized infrastructure, we were also getting emissions reductions because we were using superior technologies. I mean, there’s a lot to unpack there, but it’s, a lot is happening. I guess when taking it back to the other benchmark stat we look at, which is greenhouse gas emissions, you know, we have goals that we’ve set as a nation to be aligned with the Paris Agreement and you we are far from reaching those so even though we’ve had a return to reduced emissions across our economy we still have a lot more that we need to do and that’s what we’re watching as we go forward.

Wes Ashworth (07:41)

Yeah, and I will link that latest report in the show notes. Into this year, and I know that report’s not out yet, do you see it, has that trend continued from 2023 into 2024? Any significant things that you’ve seen start to shift this calendar year?

Lisa Jacobson (07:56)

Well, I mean, I think the early data is still showing strong deployment, whether we’ll be record breaking or not. We’re really only looking at data that’s half your data right now. But when we put it all together come January, we’ll have a clearer picture. I think those policies certainly have sent strong forward-looking price signals. But there also are some challenges, which we can talk about.

One of the things that’s changed has been this conversation about load growth. We’ve been focused for a decade or more on basically flat or steady state growth in our energy consumption. That’s electricity as well as other parts of the economy. And that’s pretty much what people were getting used to thinking about.

The conversation has really shifted to a world where with on-shoring manufacturing, data centers, data centers that also power AI, Bitcoin mining, we can pick lots of topics. Will we be in a posture over the next decade where our electricity and energy needs are going to grow? And what does that mean for all the areas that we’re focused on in terms of clean energy deployment?

Wes Ashworth (09:15)

Yeah, I think you’ve seen a lot about that and the growth of our energy demand, just as you’ve outlined there. So what I guess what challenges does that bring? If you look at it and you see, OK, we’ve been looking at this as sort of a steady, steady consumption rate. Now that growth is coming. What does that mean for the industry and what are some things that maybe we need to readjust and think about?

Lisa Jacobson (09:37)

Well, I think it’s a real opportunity, big picture. I mean, this is an opportunity to modernize our energy systems, and that’s something we need to do. A lot of the power plants that we have, their life has been greatly extended. What was 40-year, 50-year power plants, in some cases, when we think about our nuclear fleet, we may be going up to like an 80-year licensing period for some of these plants. So we’re going to need to use the portfolio of clean energy that we’re deploying today and we’re going to need to accelerate that. And I think one thing that doesn’t get as much attention is we really need to do more on the demand side. We have had strong energy efficiency policies over the years. We’ve had strong investment year on year in energy efficiency, but it’s kind of flattened out. We really have not seen what we saw, say in the early 2000s, like these dramatic hockey stick type upswings and investment and policies in the area of energy efficiency. And we’re going to need to do that.

There’s no way we can build enough if these forecasts are accurate. And there’s varied forecasts about how much load growth we really will have, right? I was just at an event last week with one of our members and even around their table, there was some disagreements. You know, these were energy planners on a regional basis saying, well, we’re looking at maybe half a percent a year and then someone else looking at what we’re looking at a percent a year. And so that we really don’t know yet what’s going to come on the system, but we need to prepare for the possibility that we’re going to be in this, you know, expansive mindset, not just a transition, but an energy expansion. And what are we going to invest in to meet those needs?

So, I mean, I’m feeling optimistic that the cost reductions in many of the technologies that are out there that are either zero or low emissions technologies are available and those are going to be what’s selected because they also in many cases have other attributes. They may be very nimble and flexible and can help balance ranging needs at different times of day. They can partner really well together when you think of like solar and storage or natural gas and renewables like all these different ways to integrate clean energy into the grid, there’s a lot of opportunity to cost effectively meet our needs with the technologies that we have. And then we also have technologies that are a bit nascent now, but are getting more investment each year, like hydrogen or carbon capture and storage, maybe small modular nuclear reactors. What’s going to happen with that suite of technologies? So I’m feeling optimistic that the energy transition can thrive even with a expansive energy consumption forecast.

Wes Ashworth (12:36)

Yeah, glad to hear the optimism, at least with that in mind. Any other recent breakthroughs or success stories in the sector, things that would benefit others to know about and learn about?

Lisa Jacobson (12:49)

Well, I think it’s really exciting to hear about all the manufacturing announcements and the new types of project partnerships that are out there. So, you know, I picked a few that I could just highlight, right? If anyone’s interested in more information, some of these are, we just came back from climate week in New York City and a few of these we did featured blogs on, but I’m also happy to share information with anybody who’d like to learn more. So, FREYR which is a battery company that’s redomiciled from Norway into the United States recently announced a Gigafactory that they are building in Coweta County, Georgia.

This is going to be focused on transportation as well as other energy sector applications and it’s going to provide over 700 high quality good paying career jobs in that area which is really exciting and I think that’s something you’re going to hear in all my examples is that this is significant local investment and significant economic job creation benefits that are going to these different parts of the country. you know there’s hydrogen hubs, talks about hydrogen, those are all over the country and this is a massive public-private partnership opportunity that we have and it’s really trying to build out hydrogen economies in different parts of the country. through this is billions of dollars of partnership investment and whole ecosystems being developed in terms of supply and demand for hydrogen and all of these hubs are a little different. And you can go to the Department of Energy website and learn more about each one, they will be very transformational. That’s really exciting to me.

I also am from New York, so we were just in climate week and through some of our events we had a number of conversations with companies that are doing things in New York state. You know, Hydro Quebec, building infrastructure in partnership with many others going from Quebec to support clean energy load delivery to New York City and to other customers. There’s offshore wind development, I heard from Equinor Empire Winds Project. It’s just 2.1 gigawatts of renewable energy, it will power one million New York City homes, or New York homes I think, broader than just New York City. So I mean, I could go on. There are many examples of clean energy stories that are going to have real community benefits.

Wes Ashworth (15:25)

Yeah, I love hearing those stories. And I think there are so, as you mentioned, there’s so many of them that you hear coming up every day, you know, with, and I love to see a lot of the collaborations and the partnerships and things like that that are happening too, which I think is well needed. So thinking about just the role of traditional energy companies, which is a big topic that comes up a lot and is discussed a lot. How do you see that role of traditional energy companies evolving as the push for renewables intensifies?

Lisa Jacobson (15:55)

Well, again, I think there’s a real market opportunity. How fast we do it and how affordably we do it are the key questions. And will we have the infrastructure available to really take that scale to the next levels, right? And I think the whole energy sector is focused on the energy transition. And there’s a role for all. So I work a lot with the natural gas industries, and it’s amazing to see what they’re doing to decarbonize and how the infrastructure can be used to support net zero goals. And I think sometimes, just like energy efficiency, we’re not looking at the portfolio. It can’t all be done with supply. We need to have that partnership between demand side solutions and decarbonizing our supply. And then we have to look at our infrastructure and say, how can we use the infrastructure that Americans have paid for? Hundreds of billions, trillions of dollars in infrastructure that we have, how can we turn that into an energy transition engine? And there’s lots of opportunity for that.

 I’m also really interested in bioenergy. Most people are familiar with sustainable aviation fuel and I think the airline industry has done a really good job of starting to communicate what their interests are with procurement of sustainable aviation fuel, but we’re still kind of in early days in that market. But nonetheless, that’s something that I think everybody can understand. And I feel like the energy transition sometimes suffers from being behind infrastructure, people don’t see it, they don’t understand it completely, right? So what airlines can do, because many people fly, is in their leadership programs, they can really help communicate that there is a whole set of clean, renewable fuels that we can use in ways that we never thought of before. So they’re kind of the poster child for biofuels because a lot of people understand that. Obviously, we can use those types of fuels for electric power, for transportation, for industrial purposes.

So there’s just so much new opportunity. And I think conventional energy companies have the expertise to deliver on that. And so we all need to work together and we need to use the expertise we have across the sector. And a lot of these skills are applicable between different industries. So offshore wind, right? Or geothermal technologies? We’re going to be using the skills that we’ve developed in the energy sector, in some cases for 100 years, to help deliver those clean and renewable resources.

Wes Ashworth (18:49)

Yeah, I love that message. Just the coming together as well, too. I think so many times people are just putting different groups against each other and it’s kind of like all the pieces need to come together. We need everybody’s involvement from traditional energy to renewable energy and all the like. So I love hearing that. You mentioned a couple of things there. One, from a natural gas perspective, and I think this does get confused. A lot of people just sort of dismiss it and like, that has nothing to do with renewable energy and it’s harmful, blah, blah. And then others are saying like, yeah, it’s vital. It’s a part of the transition and helping us get there. And as you said, some of the infrastructure sort of things. Can you, I guess, just expand on that, clarify that a little bit and for the audience that’s listening, maybe we can help shed some light on that topic.

Lisa Jacobson (19:38)

Yeah, definitely. I mean, if you look at where our emissions reduction have come in the last 20 years, I think natural gas can contribute almost 60% of those emissions reductions because we’ve basically shifted, we brought on more renewables, at the end of 2023, we were at 23% of our electricity mix from renewable energy, which is record breaking.

For example, our nuclear fleet has pretty much been steady state about 20% of our electricity mix, so this is more renewable energy, more than our nuclear fleet last year, and I think that was the second or third year in a row. Coal used to be a predominant way we would electrify, and now we’ve really decarbonized. I think we were at 16% of our proportional electricity mix from coal at the end of 2023. So natural gas has also been an area where we’ve had expansion, natural gas, electricity generation, and renewable energy combined with energy efficiency is really what’s enabled very strong emissions reduction. in the power sector. So I think we’re about like 40% below 2005 levels.

But we still have a long way to go in the power sector as well as a long way to go with our greenhouse gas emissions reductions economy-wide. So we need to do more there. But anyway, so natural gas has made a lot of contributions to the current emissions reductions we’ve had. But looking forward, if we’re going to net zero focus, we need to decarbonize much more significantly and much faster. Using natural gas more efficiently in our economy is certainly one way to get significant emissions reductions. Then second, there are ways to provide renewable natural gas into our system.

There are over 20 states that have programs that allow for renewable natural gas to be offered to customers, whether that be in their homes or businesses. And also there are opportunities in the power sector. Right now, renewable natural gas is mostly used in our transportation sector. Many people may not know that. So this is like an active market. And what’s really exciting about renewable natural gas is it really is a circular economy opportunity because we are capturing methane either from agriculture or farms or food waste. There are a number of feedstocks, but basically we are taking what otherwise would be really challenging waste and capturing it and creating renewable energy from it, that’s another way. Others, our infrastructure, as we talked about, we talk about a hydrogen economy.

We talked about the hydrogen hubs. I mean, we can use our natural gas pipeline system to help facilitate hydrogen. we’re, that’s very much in the forefront right now. So there are two resources that I would point your listeners to. One is GTI Energy based out of Chicago, Illinois. So it’s GTI, Gas Technology Institute, which is their former name, but now it’s GTI Energy. And they have a number of best in class technical programs focused on decarbonization of natural gas systems, as well as just more broadly achieving net zero economy.

And they talk a lot about how natural gas infrastructure can be used in a net zero world. Then I would point you to the American Gas Association. So this is the Association of Gas Utilities in the United States. And they did a net zero strategies analysis a couple of years ago that’s really amazing. And it kind of focuses on the areas that I discussed, you know, energy efficiency, decarbonization of natural gas and using infrastructure and that they can help achieve net zero strategy. take a look at those resources. As you said, we need to be focused on what we can do together and with a focus on decarbonization. And no one sector can do it on its own. We will need all of these sectors and we will need investment focused on the most affordable options.

Wes Ashworth (24:07)

Absolutely. And I’ll link both of those in the show notes as well, too. So thank you for sharing those resources. To switch gears a little bit to more policy and advocacy type of topics, how is BCSE working to shape policy that supports renewable energy growth? What does that look like today?

Lisa Jacobson (24:24)

Well, we’ve been really focused on trying to implement the tax policies in the Inflation Reduction Act. These tax policies for renewable energy take the form of an investment tax credit structure and a production tax credit structure for renewable energy. They’ve been around since the early 1990s and we had the opportunity through the Inflation Reduction Act for the first time to have a 10-year window to utilize these credits. They also have been modernized and expanded. So for example, we have an energy storage investment tax credit, which we didn’t have before. It was part of a renewable investment tax credit for solar, but was not standalone. And so that’s just one example of some of the expansion.

They all need guidelines in this new world. And we’ve been focused a lot on the policy side of trying to implement them and write the guidelines that will enable the market to utilize them. So a lot of submissions to the IRS and the US Treasury Department. You could go onto the BCSE website. We have them all listed, all the ones that we’ve done. We also have been working with Congress in making sure they understand the importance of this historic set of changes and we want to not disrupt the market signals that we have which we can show are already really accelerating this marketplace. Those are just a couple of the areas where we’ve been focused. We also care a lot about infrastructure, as I said. So a big opportunity to expand renewable energy deployment on the utility scale is through new electric transmission.

And electric transmission that crosses states. And there’s regulatory work in that area as well as ways to provide financial incentives. So permitting and citing reform at the national level as well as encouraging states and localities to streamline their processes for projects that they want to see implemented because it just takes too long to build. I mean, there’s a lot of areas where we support renewable energy and hopefully we’ll continue to see progress.

Wes Ashworth (26:49)

I’m thankful for the work that you’re doing for sure. Any upcoming policies? I think we can all sort of get behind current policies and I think most people are aware of those somewhat. Anything that’s coming or you see on the near horizon that you will believe, I guess will have a significant impact on the renewable energy transition.

Lisa Jacobson (27:11)

I mean, I think it’s unfinished business on permitting and siting and, you know, our federal regulator role will be as it relates to transmission planning and financing for, you know, for transmission. So we’re in the midst of lots of work, but that is going to definitely extend in the years ahead. I think, again, maintaining the policy direction we have with this broad set of clean energy and renewable energy tax credits is critical because what’s, as I said, it’s not just the investment tax credit and the production tax credit for renewable energy anymore.

We have credits for hydrogen, storage, carbon capture and storage. Also, the traditional renewable energy focused credits are now based on carbon intensity and we’re still working on the rules for that. that’s going to allow other technologies to come in. And I think that’s what we really need. The market signals to create more public private partnership for the whole portfolio of energy efficient and clean energy technologies.

Wes Ashworth (28:20)

Yeah, and another thing I want to get into that is something I believe wholeheartedly in is just bipartisan support for renewable energy policy. I guess how does BCSE navigate this and can you just expand a little bit just on how important it is and why regardless of where you are, what side you sit on, you should support renewable energy growth?

Lisa Jacobson (28:36)

Yes, you should. And the good news is that that is the foundation we’re working from. I mean, thinking about the tax credits at the federal level, those have had bipartisan support since the early 1990s. And so and in many cases, their primary champions in the beginning were Republicans. So this is a very market oriented policy where we’re leveraging, you know, taxpayer money and getting significant private sector investment due to it, and we’re reducing taxes. This is really powerful tool and it has worked.

All of our policies, we’re much better off when we can adopt bipartisan policies. Sometimes they don’t get enacted that way, but the core policy itself is something that has bipartisan support. So I think that’s the kind of window we’re going to be looking at the next Congress in. No matter who is elected president or the makeup of Congress, many of these policies are benefiting communities all out throughout the country and have no political wing. They’re going everywhere and communities, no matter their political leanings, are all benefiting.

So I think that’s going to be the foundation. And I think we’re going to have to have more education and conversations. But we are in a good place because these policies have had bipartisan support for so many years. just working as our organization, we are not a political organization. We are a trade association, but we’re nonpartisan. And we work with everybody, talk with everybody and that’s why things like the Sustainable Energy in America Factbook are so useful is because you’re not talking about policy advocacy, you’re giving people facts and you can have your own determination of what you see, that line going up, that line going down, but at least we have a common, we’re trying to have a common framework to assess policy decisions with.

Wes Ashworth (30:44)

Yeah, well said and I agree wholeheartedly. And looking at a little bit of future outlook, and I’d love to hear your perspective. So what are some of the transformative trends or other things you see in the renewable energy sector over the next decade?

Lisa Jacobson (31:00)

Energy storage is a place to watch. Right now the key markets for energy storage in the United States are like California and Texas and they’re often paired with solar and that’s great. We want to see more of that but we want to see storage, long duration energy storage, become more mainstream in the market. We’re still working on that. We want to see storage, right now there’s a lot of batteries related to a electric transportation and that’s very appropriate but we also need storage to support these utility scale projects. So I think that’s an area definitely to be watching.

Wes Ashworth (31:43)

Yeah, agreed. And from your perspective too, what are some of the key focus areas just for the industry to ensure sustained growth and impact? I mean, we mentioned some of the demands increasing and those sort of things, but any of those key focus areas that you see that we really need to pay attention to and make sure we’re spending time on.

Lisa Jacobson (32:01)

Well, I think supply chains have been a big area and workforce has been a big area. One of our climate week events, we had Abby Hopper, who’s the CEO of the Solar Energy Industries Association, also on our board, kind of kick off one of our sessions. And it was like, what are the three things that are really critical? And I think this is fairly universal, is people and community benefits and making sure that we are in touch and in sync with the communities where we want to work. Both to get their acceptance and support, but also to make sure we have careers for them and that they’re getting the economic benefits from this investment goods, equipment, supply chains, just making sure that we have reliable, secure supply chains that will enable us to deploy at the scale that we wish to.

And some of that is taking a direction of on-shoring supply chains or reassessing supply chains. And I would say it’s a big policy question too. So how do we make sure that we’re striking that balance of having strong domestic national benefits as we go through the energy transition, but also not limiting our ability to reduce emissions and to deploy. So what’s that appropriate sweet spot as we go through this transition over the next five, 10 years? So that’s a big deal. I mean, the last thing goes back to something I said in the beginning is interest rates. Interest rates, you we had an interest rate cut, but there’s still a lot more to be done in terms of having a stable interest rate environment. So that’s something else I think people are watching.

Wes Ashworth (33:52)

All great points. And just some general advice for other leaders, and a lot of the listeners are leaders in renewable energy space, or people that are working in the space or interested in the space, but specifically to those leaders in those companies that are navigating the challenges and opportunities over the next decade. There’s policy things, there’s a lot of different complexities, supply chain issues, all these sorts of things. What are some general pieces of advice you would offer to those leaders?

Lisa Jacobson (34:23)

Well, Make your challenges and your success stories known because we’re all in this together and everyone gets very focused on what they’re doing to the extent possible. Please share, share with your associations, share with community and policymakers, community leaders and policymakers because we need to know where the pain points are from a market perspective. And so that’s really important. Engage to the best extent you can in the policy discussions because that’s the rules of the road for your investment plans for the next five to ten years. So speak up and engage.

Wes Ashworth (35:03)

Yeah, that’s something I’ve heard a lot of and I think the critical importance of communications individuals in the industry as well and representatives in these companies that are doing a great job at telling these stories, getting that out, making sure that it’s known and I think we need more and more and more of that. So I agree with that. I love seeing that trend. I think a lot more companies even this year have really gotten behind that and trying to get that out. So that can continue to expand. And then one other quick point of just seeking your advice.

So how can the industry prepare for unforeseen challenges, like geopolitical shifts or technological disruptions? We’re coming up on election, a lot of people are, some are nervous, some are anxious, some are kind of going, “What’s going to happen?” and vice versa. So some of those unforeseen challenges or challenges may come up depending on what happens. How can the industry prepare?

Lisa Jacobson (35:55)

Well, I mean, those are really big challenges. I mean, I can tell you what BCSE is doing. I mean, we are wide-eyed and thinking about all scenarios, trying to develop strategies. But I mean, for us, it’s because we’re nonpartisan, and we really do believe our area policy education and advocacy is best suited by talking to people, sharing good information and data, and then trying to craft policies that will leverage private sector investment where communities want those kinds of investments. I feel like our sphere is a little different than someone who might be making, you know, big decisions on an investment. I mean, the market trends are clear. We’re going to cleaner, more modern energy services.

So, you know, maybe the next 12 to 18 months has uncertainties in this moment in time, but that’s what customers want and technology prices have come down. We have a lot more experience with technologies. We have some challenges for deployment, but those are well discussed. So I feel like good minds are focused on overcoming those challenges. what’s been interesting to me is watching, there’s been all this conversation about the challenges we have with electric transmission.

How are particular projects addressing that in the short term, right? Like just kind of looking at what you read, you the news clips of like, that’s an interesting partnership that they came up with. Now, is that going to solve the problem or does it take away from the need to address the larger systemic issue? No, but people are getting creative because there’s a strong signal from customers and they have these policies that are really enabling them to leverage each other. So it’s encouraging.

Wes Ashworth (37:56)

Yeah, I agree. I mean, I think these challenges have been, you know, it’s the uncertainty, especially. I mean, uncertainty is something I think as a society, we’ve gotten really comfortable with over the last five years. You know, there’s been a lot of uncertainty, a lot of disruptions, a lot of just things that were unforeseen. And still here we are, still moving forward, still progressing. And as you said, 2023, you know, record breaking type of numbers. And that’s my confidence and sentiment is, it’s not going anywhere, you know.

There may be bumps on the road, there may be things that are unforeseen, but at the end of the day, we’re still headed there. And I think this train is going and can’t be stopped at this point. That’s my opinion, so I agree. So getting closer on time and just wrapping up here, if you could share one key message with those working in or following the renewable energy sector.

What would it be? What do you want the main takeaway or inspiration that you’d like to leave with our listeners today?

Lisa Jacobson (39:00)

Yeah, just keep going. know, be persistent, be creative, reach out. You know, as you were saying before, we need to come together as a sector and, you know, we all need a strong and expansive workforce, right? So we’re all working in different communities. There’s a lot of opportunity to reach out to others in the sector and other stakeholders that care about deployment of renewable energy or the energy transition. just keep at it, know? Just keep going, the market is on your side.

Wes Ashworth (39:39)

Yeah, yeah, no, well said. And one of my favorite parts of this industry is you see competitors in the space that help each other and collaborate and share ideas. And I think that is such a unique thing, but also a beautiful thing that it is that, you know, it’s a bit more mission driven. We all see that, you know, we all need to come together and help each other along the way. And people that are literally competing for the same space, you know, are helping each other. And so I encourage, put that out there that just continue that, continue the collaboration, continue reaching out, continue seeking collaboration from other people and advice and what have you. So well said.

So that’ll wrap up another insightful episode of Green Giant’s Titans of Renewable Energy. Huge thank you to Lisa for sharing your deep expertise and valuable perspectives on the current trends and future outlook of renewable energy. It’s clear that the work you’re doing is instrumental in driving policy and fostering collaboration across industries. To our listeners out there as always, if you found today’s conversation as inspiring as I did, be sure to subscribe, share, and stay tuned for more exciting interviews with the leader shaping the future of clean energy. And thanks for tuning in and we will see you next time.